The 10th Mofo Movie Hall of Fame

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-27-16

Sure,i ment that that you dont really get to see the pure humiliation that she has to go through.
For example one scene she is at a "pool party",and you just see the close up of different men.

I can tell you have a knack for looking at movies and seeing what would have made it better. I agree, you're right, we don't see much humiliation when the close ups are mostly all on the men's faces.

I think if we had gotten to see it filmed from a distance as a "normal" scene it would have shown better how shes treated as an object and how humiliating it was. if for example they had shown her arriving-them undressing her or telling her to-then show the different men approaching her and then have the closeups inbetween.
You just see the men-you dont see her.

I agree too, but I wonder if the director might have feared a 'normal wide camera shot' of all the men having sex with her at the pool party, would end up looking more like porn, and so diminish our caring for her.

But yeah I mostly agree that the focus needed to be more on her, so to show us how horrible it was for her.

I also wish they would have shown her pimp beating her up and not just her bruised afterwards-thats what i mean by raw.
they leave out things to make it more comfortable for us to watch but with a movie with a message like this i dont necasseraly thinks they should make it comfortable.

I agree with you here too, it's like the part in Sweden which should be the hardest hitting part is done softer for the audience but it's still tough to watch.

Yes,shes a real girl-it was a massive thing in sweden but newslet in other countries apparantly refused to cover it.
human trafficking unfortunatly has a lot of support from people with power.

Was it tied to the Russian mafia?

Topsy

My only Wish

06-27-16

The Story of the real Lilya for those interested

View Spoilers

WARNING: spoilers below

her name was Danguolė Rasalait.
the things that differ from reality is that the boy doesnt excist.
other things thats changed or left out:
When she got to Sweden she was locked in the apartment and told that she owed them 20.000 for getting her there.she had to "work it off".
they then sent over 40 men a day to her apartment. She manages to escape one day breaking one of the windows-shes too scared to go to the police so she runs to a nearby pizzaplace and asks for a glass of water. He then offers her to stay with him. He then finds out that she used to be sold as a prostitute and locks her in his basement where he and his friends gangrape her.she again manages to escape and goes to live with a drug additct and her mother.they are under constant threats from the russians and find out that the russians have cameras in the airport to stop girls from escaping.she meets a guy who she get involved with but when hes told she used be a prostitute he tells her he wants nothing to do with her. she then laters jumps from the bridge and ends up in a coma for three days before shes declared braindead and passes away. She has a few number written down in her pocket which leads police to the apartment she was held.there they find several letters to her friends back home telling them everything that had happened to her. The girl she had stayed with gave the names of the men to the police but so far no one has been held accountable for anything she went through.

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Originally Posted by cricket

Britney is my favorite

Camo

Msg

BANNED

06-27-16

but I wonder if the director might have feared a 'normal wide camera shot' of all the men having sex with her at the pool party, would end up looking more like porn, and so diminish our caring for her.

That's the way i took it. I see both of your points of views but i have to agree seeing her naked no matter how brutal and wrong it is would be sexualising it. I think it was a lot better the way it was shown personally. Reminds me of how there is no shown violence (or very, very little) in Shotgun Stories and it helps make the movie all the more powerful because it isn't about the violence but the results.

Camo

Msg

BANNED

06-27-16

Just read that. Brutal

Topsy

My only Wish

06-27-16

Originally Posted by Camo

Topsy, Sweet Sixteen if you are still planning on watching it has a similar gritty feel to it both visually and story wise as Lilya 4-Ever. It is a Ken Loach film and as i said that is what it reminded me of.

Yes i noticed,thats what was appealing about it to me

I`ll pm you if theres something i dont understand whilst watching it

Citizen Rules

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-27-16

Originally Posted by Camo

Yup, I'm glad we don't see her naked for the reason you said.

Topsy

My only Wish

06-27-16

Originally Posted by Citizen Rules

I can tell you have a knack for looking at movies and seeing what would have made it better. I agree, you're right, we don't see much humiliation when the close ups are mostly all on the men's faces.

I agree too, but I wonder if the director might have feared a 'normal wide camera shot' of all the men having sex with her at the pool party, would end up looking more like porn, and so diminish our caring for her.

But yeah I mostly agree that the focus needed to be more on her, so to show us how horrible it was for her.
I agree with you here too, it's like the part in Sweden which should be the hardest hitting part is done softer for the audience but it's still tough to watch.

Was it tied to the Russian mafia?

It doesnt say anywhere (that ive read) directly that its the russian mafia. but i would assume so.

I see both you guys points about the sex part and making it too sexual-
I dont think they should have shown the actual sex part nessecarrily,but i think they could have demostrated better how she was treated as an object to laugh at and "have fun with" and not a real human being.

Citizen Rules

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-27-16

Lilya 4-Ever has been a great film to kick off the 10th Hof! I hope more people can watch it and soon and post their thoughts. BTW, the Youtube video of the movie is excellent quality, I streamed it to my big TV and it looked great.

Camo

Msg

BANNED

06-27-16

What are you two watching next? I'm going for Cul-De-Sac since Cricket sent me that link.

Topsy

My only Wish

06-27-16

i was thinking i would see what most others were watching.
im good with Cul-De-Sac being next.

seanc

Trying Real Hard To Be The Shepherd

06-27-16

Lilya 4 Ever I will just echo a lot of what you guys have already said. This is a tough sit at times but one that is worth it. I think CR saying it was like a documentary at times is a good way to describe it. I really felt like it was a brutal and honest portrayal of the poverty stricken in this town she lived in. Everyone just trying to escape even to the detriment of those they love, like caged animals. So many emotional moments. The scene with her mom, the basketball, and then of course when she goes to Sweden. I think you guys are also dead on about the sex. I actually caught myself turning my head during the montage, although we are essentially seeing nothing. That is good story telling. Fine nomination Topsy, I am glad to have seen it.

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Letterboxd

seanc

Trying Real Hard To Be The Shepherd

06-27-16

I put Cul-De-Sac up next in my Netflix que, so hopefully I will get to it by the weekend.

cricket

Registered User

06-27-16

Lilya 4-Ever

This was the movie I was most looking forward to since it was already on my watchlist. I feel like there's something I can't put my finger on that prevents it from being truly great, but it was pretty much what I expected and hoped for. The story is just so powerful, more powerful than the movie as a whole. Perhaps I feel this way because they held back somewhat as others have said? I don't think it could have been filmed any better; the look and feel of the film is perfect, and the lead actress does a fantastic job. If there was any part of the movie that I didn't care for, it was the angel element. I do not know much about human trafficking from country to country, but I have to say it seemed realistic. As far as the clients, predators, and the way she first got into prostitution in her own country, that was all very realistic. Not quite a new personal favorite, but this was an excellent nomination.

Citizen Rules

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-28-16

Do you know, how I know that Lilya 4-Ever is powerful? I took one look at the photo Cricket used on his post, and it instantly called up a strong negative emotion in me, as I remembered how brutally the bath tub scene was. Scant few movies have had that kind of effect on me.

Citizen Rules

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-28-16

Cricket did you by any chance watch that one with your wife? If so what was her reaction?

cricket

Registered User

06-28-16

Originally Posted by Citizen Rules

Cricket did you by any chance watch that one with your wife? If so what was her reaction?

No, she's not big into foreign films. If she was, we would have seen that already. She loves movies like that; for instance Boys Don't Cry-powerful and upsetting.

Citizen Rules

Trouble with a capital "T"

06-28-16

OK thanks....oh did anyone notice on the youtube the video the subtitles were occasionally misspelled? No big deal to me as I misspell stuff all the time.

seanc

Trying Real Hard To Be The Shepherd

06-28-16

Yeah the subtitles were wonky.

Topsy

My only Wish

06-28-16

tell her to watch requiem for a dream if you guys havent already..thats another i was thinking of nominating.
esp the part with the mother gets me every time.

seanc