[quote=John McClane]Being a cinephile means whatever you want it to mean.

[img]https://s3.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/article/3/6/4/785364_320x180.jpg[/img][/quote]

[quote=Sedai]I would say many of the recent Disney live action remakes of their animated films usurp Marvel as the worst shit out there recently.[/quote]

[quote=Mr Minio]I get where you're coming from, of course. I used to be like that for years, too. But it's vain, empty, and, frankly, just silly. I one is a cinephile, this requires a superior look at the art of cinema than that of a Sunday movie lover. Being a cinephile is an obligation of first feeling, then understanding, and then responding to that feeling and understanding with apt assessment of a work of film. If a film doesn't fulfill your artistic virtues (here's where subjectivity comes into play), it's a failure of a film and has to be treated as such. Of course, this is still nowhere close to where Marvel movies fall. They're the worst of the worst safe for maybe James Gunn. The dude is not very talented but at least he tries to do something more.[/quote]

[quote=Mr Minio][quote=FilmBuff]The majority of people in this world don't pay good money to watch art - they pay money to have a good time. And a movie that delivers a good time is seen as a wise investment of one's time and money.[/quote]
Bemoaningly, this is true. People also pay good money to go clubbing or eat at a fast-food place. Marvel equals cinema with such activities.

If there's nothing you hate in film, there's a good reason to be suspect of your opinions. The very idea of having a taste includes the idea that there are some things you cannot stand.[/quote]

[quote=John McClane]the number of users that try to put their own fault on IT….yup, not enough fingers to count that[/quote]

[quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio]
But of course, it's disgusting to talk about money when we talk about art. Saying that a film made a lot of money has nothing to do with its artistic quality, to begin with. I'm not gullible enough to believe that we can separate money and art, we never could. [/quote]

The majority of people in this world don't pay good money to watch art - they pay money to have a good time. And a movie that delivers a good time is seen as a wise investment of one's time and money.[/quote]

[quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio][quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio]
Really loving something requires you to really hate something within that something.[/quote]

I don't think that's the case at all... I love cinema in the greatest possible sense, I cherish the opportunity to watch any new film, whether it's good, bad or mediocre. The more mediocre films I watch, the more I'm reminded of how special the really good ones are. It's all part of being deeply in love with cinema, in a non-judgemental way.[/quote]

You put yourself through so many bad films and yet you love the experiene and the whole thing, but there must be things in cinema that you hate and not accept. There must be an idea of cinema that you strongly oppose.[/quote]

No, I wouldn't say I hate any aspect of it, there's just some stuff I like better. 
Have you watched Macaroni? It is, objectively, a fairly mediocre movie, yet there is considerable pleasure to be had from watching Jack Lemmon and Marcello Mastroianni working together![/quote]

[quote=Mr Minio][quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio]
Really loving something requires you to really hate something within that something.[/quote]

I don't think that's the case at all... I love cinema in the greatest possible sense, I cherish the opportunity to watch any new film, whether it's good, bad or mediocre. The more mediocre films I watch, the more I'm reminded of how special the really good ones are. It's all part of being deeply in love with cinema, in a non-judgemental way.[/quote]

You put yourself through so many bad films and yet you love the experiene and the whole thing, but there must be things in cinema that you hate and not accept. There must be an idea of cinema that you strongly oppose.[/quote]

[quote=Mr Minio]Every Hollywood film IS a big hit. Even those that fail at the box office are seen by more people than masterworks by masters like Costa or Green.

But of course, it's disgusting to talk about money when we talk about art. Saying that a film made a lot of money has nothing to do with its artistic quality, to begin with. I'm not gullible enough to believe that we can separate money and art, we never could. But we can do many things. We can promote artistic license and independence. We can promote true beauty and true art that stands in opposition to what Marvel represents and does. We can, ultimately, educate ourselves to better see and understand why and how the sort of atrocity that Marvel proposes isn't and cannot be worth anything for anybody who takes cinema seriously, that is as a work of art.[/quote]

[quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio]
Really loving something requires you to really hate something within that something.[/quote]

I don't think that's the case at all... I love cinema in the greatest possible sense, I cherish the opportunity to watch any new film, whether it's good, bad or mediocre. The more mediocre films I watch, the more I'm reminded of how special the really good ones are. It's all part of being deeply in love with cinema, in a non-judgemental way.[/quote]

[quote=FilmBuff][quote=Mr Minio]One last note about popularity. Marvel spends millions, billions on marketing. If you advertise something long enough and hard enough, people will want it.[/quote]
Now, that's a complete fallacy and you know it. No amount of M&A can get people to go to the theaters for something they don't really like.

If spending a lot was all that was needed to make a hit, then every Hollywood film would be a big hit, because they could easily afford to advertise heavily for all of their movies.

Yet the studios all have their share of box-office disappointments - just look at Furiosa right now.[/quote]